David Icke talks with Bill Ryan from Project Avalon

Bill Ryan (BR): This is Bill Ryan from Project Avalon, and it’s the date… and I’ll say that again, let me start one more time. I’ll tell you what you could do actually, could you do one of these hand clap things…

David Icke (DI): Yeah sure. Well, one and a half hand claps I can do. [laughs]

BR: This is the sound of a one and a half hands clapping. [laughs]

DI: Yeah, yeah… [claps his hands twice]

BR: Very good, okay… Very nice. So.

DI: I’ve the quietest clapper ever, me, I have to do it something like this [claps the bottom of his hands together]

BR: [laughs] You have to remind me. One of these days those idiots on YouTube are gonna get the hang of the fact that you’ve got arthritis and therefore you can’t do a proper handshake, you know. [laughs]We should do a demonstration on this video…

DI: Yeah, this is a…

BR: …of Look, you know, we’re trying our best to…

DI: That’s a Masonic handshake, ladies and gentlemen… [laughs]

BR: …We’re trying our best to shake hands here…

DI: …it’s a Masonic handshake between, ah, masons who’ve got rheumatoid arthritis in their hands, you know, it’s a, it’s an old tradition…

BR: …Aaah…

DI: …goes back to Babylon. [They both laugh]

BR: So, this is Bill Ryan from Project Avalon and the date is the 19th of May, 2010. And even now I can’t quite believe it’s 2010. You know, David, sometimes you must look back and you think “My God, it was in the early 1990’s last time I looked. Time is accelerating.” Do you find that sometimes?

DI: I find it all the time, Bill. When I first had my conscious awakening in 1990 and I started meeting psychic after psychic who were just giving me the same basic confirming repeating information, one of the earliest things that I came across was something that I called the Truth Vibrations. In fact, the first book I ever wrote on these subjects was called Truth Vibrations because of this.

And it was – and, my goodness me there was no sign of it at the time, to say the least – there was a vibrational change in the process of it manifesting, and this was going to; a) break up the density that was holding people in servitude, in the collective coma if you like, and people are gonna wake up and see themselves and the world in a different way; and the other thing that it was going to bring to the surface all that had remained hidden.

And again, you know, as we know: 1990, are you kidding? No sign of it. But look at it now, it’s unbelievable the number of people who are waking up all over the world to a new version of self and the world. And, my goodness, how much information has hit the surface that wasn’t there 20 years ago? How many? Not, ten years ago, five years ago, it’s an exponential curve.

And one of the interesting aspects of this which I, again, picked up in those early days, was a… One line through a psychic to me was: eventually, time is gonna pass so fast, it’s going to be frightening. Because, time and space – for me, anyway – are not real, well we know that, they are a construct.

If you take a computer disk and it’s got information on it, and it’s programmed with certain data, and you put it in the computer. That computer will read that data and it will take that, if you like, digital level, information level, and it will put it on the screen as apparently time and space. And we’re doing that, and the left brain is taking information, and it’s sequencing it.

And the more quickly it makes that sequence happen, the more time seems to be passing quicker and the reverse in the other way. And so, as people, Einstein said: if you sit in the dentist waiting room, then that sequence is not very fast – [mumbling:] Oh my goodness…man…gone…mnnn. And then you’ve got, I think in his analogy you’re in the company of a beautiful woman, and “ssshhhh” [motioning forward] the sequence is real quick.

And what seems to be the situation is that this energetic change, as we change from an epoch of suppression to an epoch of expansion and enlightenment, and awareness, is that it’s having the effect of the way we decode reality, the way we decode sequence, appears to be being fundamentally affected.

And I said in an article the other day, did April happen? Did we have March? If so, why did I miss it? Because that’s what it seems to me, that’s just extraordinary the way Christmas… What, wh… When was Christmas? I mean, two years ago? I mean it’s just amazing what’s happening.

BR: This awakening that you refer to, you saw that in front of your eyes at the Brixton Academy just a few days ago when you did your major, new rollout presentation after the publication of your new book. And, of course, this is why this interview is timed the way that it is because – let me talk to the audience here: David’s got a substantial amount of important new information, and in Brixton, that was the first time that you did your eight or was it nine hours? We’re talking about…

DI: Eight hours actual talking, yeah.

BR: That was a pretty big rollout, and you told me the other day that you were blown away by the response that you got from those people whereas 15 years ago, you were playing to empty chairs. Things have changed, haven’t they?

DI: Oh, it’s extraordinary. I… I… You know, when I started out, 20 years ago, despite, you know, not just the ridicule, the mass ridicule, but when I started to go around talking about stuff – of course, I knew a lot less then now, as we all did – but, it was like banging your head against the wall, you know. I would put the chairs out, no one would come, basically, and then I’d talk to empty chairs and a few people, and then I’d put the chairs back and go home. And that was it, that was the night.

And you thought: no chance, this is going nowhere. But you know, as we all know, something drives you on. Something deep drives you on: “Keep going, keep going”. And you think, Oh, what’s the point? – “Keep going”.

And, over the last particularly ten years, I mean maybe I started picking up really about 15 but then ten and then five because the curve is going like that [motions upward], it’s just extraordinary, mate, I mean all over the world, it doesn’t matter what culture you go into – of course, some are more suppressed and therefore close-minded than others but – all over the world, it’s extraordinary, you know.

What I picked up in 1990 about these Truth Vibrations, this awakening, this… the way this energetic change was gonna break up the density that was holding us in servitude and ignorance: it’s happening.

And, you know, you go through the years and you think, you know, It’s all doom and gloom and all the rest of it, and when you look at the way society is going, if you watch the television news and read the newspapers, you would think that this Orwellian global fascist communist – same thing, different name – dictatorship, this Orwellian global state, was basically a done deal, because it is moving real, real fast, but…

And if you only come from the five-sense level of this, and you only see, you know, what the conscious mind can see and perceive, then I can completely understand why people take that on, I completely understand why there are many, you know, researchers into the five-sense level of the conspiracy who are just going [motions pulling his hairs out] “There’s nothing we can do!”

But there is, because this is… This world is not like we think it is. There are other forces at work. This so-called physical solid reality is not physical and solid at all, it’s fluid. It doesn’t seem to be like that, but it is. And because it’s got this fluidity behind the apparent stiffness and solidity and immovability, it means that this level of reality can change very, very fast.

See, when people perceive that – I completely understand it because the conscious mind is completely giving us this … focus of reality – when we think that the physical world has to change by changing physical things, then you’re looking at time scales of change that are just enormous – as we perceive time, anyway – because that’s how it is in the so-called solid world.

But when you realize that this so-called solid world is actually just a holographic projection, and the real base reality of this universe is wave form vibrating information, then the speed that this world can change suddenly takes on dramatically different proportions. For instance, if you had a computer screen and you had to change that computer screen or what was on it, physically, I mean: where do you bloody start? But that computer screen is a projection from information on a disk. “Okay, so I want to change that, okay: disk out, reprogram, press enter, disk in” – Woooow! Different world.

And what’s happening now, as part of this whole Truth Vibrations transformation, is the information construct of this universe is changing – as it does, it’s a cycle and then the ancients talked about the circular nature of time. And this, this for me, Bill – I can only speak, you know, when I talk like this, from where I’m coming from and what I’ve researched; people have to come to their own conclusions of course, it’s only right – but, the ancients talked about the circular nature of time, and it is. It’s like a cosmic game.

And we go through different epochs – what the Indian culture calls Yugas and other people around the world have different names for them – where this cycle goes through times of great expansion, what the ancients called the Golden Age. And it goes through periods of suppression when things are not like that at all and there’s great challenges, and that’s when control systems come in and all the rest of it, and then there are others that bring this back to where we started and the whole sequence starts again.

It’s an interactive computer game – in the simplest possible way – in that we are picking up information from the game, like the computer picks up information from the disk and puts it on the screen, but we are also, as with the Internet, posting our unique contribution to this game. So it’s an interactive game: we give and we receive, in it.

And it seems very powerfully right to me, going right back to the Truth Vibrations coming into my life 20 years ago, that awareness of it, anyway, is that we are moving at this time from a period of suppression – I don’t think anyone needs any convincing of that – and we’re moving into a period of much greater expansion of consciousness, expansion of awareness, from fear and insecurity.

And insecurity is the key to understanding why people want control: if people want control, or any other entity, whatever we want to call them, want control over others, want control over – not the power to express your own life, express your own experience, but power over others’ experience, which is what we’re talking about with the control system – then that is always, always, always the manifestation of deep insecurity.

So the control system is run by insecure people. And we’re moving from this period now, and we’re at this cusp which is why it’s all really bumpy, because we’re now in this period where there is a tussle, symbolically and literally in many ways, between the energetic construct of this control – suppressed epoch, if you like – and the cusp going into this other one.

And so, we’ve got a situation where the control system is desperately trying to hold on to its power which it’s had through this period, and the Truth Vibrations, this energetic quickening – which delivers to us a whole new level of information to decode and, therefore, manifest a different world – they’re at this tussle point, this cusp point. And every minute, and every year as we measure time that passes, this Truth Vibrations level of awareness is going to be imposing itself as the norm.

And so I say that the control system is doomed. I’m incredibly optimistic. It’s not a case of [makes a little voice:] It’s doomed, it’s doomed, so I’m gonna sit here and do nothing coz it’s doomed. It’s not like that. We are an expression of these energies, and, therefore, we need to tune into them, follow their guidance, follow their inspiration, whatever, and be a five-sense-reality expression of them.

It’s not just about sitting around and letting it happen. We’re making choices here: are we gonna go with this new flow of massive expansion and freedom and potential of unimaginable proportions compared with our reality here, or are we going to try to hold on to the world that we’ve lived in up to this point, the ‘control and suppression’ and ‘winners and losers’ and “some must have therefore a lot must lose” and all this stuff. Because that’s the choice we’re making, that’s the fork in the road.

And people who hold on to this energy, this reality, are going to have some real challenging times – everyone is, of course, because we’re at this epoch of change – but really challenging times, because they’re attaching their awareness, they’re attaching their sense of reality to an energetic construct that is in its death throes.

And if you bring it back, Bill, to the control system that we’re exposing and is manifesting or trying to manifest itself more and more, then that is an absolute, one-hundred-percent holographic manifestation of this old-epoch energetic construct. Therefore, it must fall when the energetic construct falls. If I take that disk out of the computer, that picture on the screen that the computer is manifesting from that information must go black. It must go blank. Because the information construct which has created that is no longer there, and that’s where we’re going.

And like I said, we’re in for some challenging times because we’re in this bumpy middle cusp changeover period, the transformation, but my goodness me, you know, our kids and grandkids are not going to live most of their lives in a control system as it so looks like they’re going to at this time, and will look like it for a few years yet. But this whole thing’s coming down.

It’s a great time to be alive. Very wonderful time to be here, to see suppression and limitation replaced by expansion and infinite potential. Wonderful, wonderful time, challenging as it is.

BR: What I love about the way that you explain about that is that it marries perfectly, some viewers may recognize this, with the theoretical work of a British physicist called David Bohm, B-O-H-M. He described exactly what you’re referring to as the implicate reality and the explicate reality.

DI: Yes, right, yeah.

BR: Have you heard of that before?

DI: Yeah, yeah.

BR: And the way to change the explicate reality, which is like what is ex-pressed in our apparent physicality, is there’s this implicate reality behind all this. And, of course, high-technology ETs, advanced spiritual beings, or mischievous spiritual beings or evil spiritual beings who don’t want to know what they’re there, they mess around with the implicate reality and then the results are like metaphorical projections on the wall, on the explicate reality, and this is kind of what you’re saying. So I just wanted to close that loop there, because you’re not talking nonsense here, this is recognized by quantum physicists everywhere.

DI: Well, that’s an interesting point, Bill. I mean, maybe I could explain something that I’ve got in this new book, Human Race Get off Your Knees, which relates to that in terms of how I’m saying this control system came about, certainly the control system in the time that we can go back and recognize it.

I’m saying that there was a time when this planet, this reality, was in the period of what the ancients called the Golden Age – in fact I think there’s a Golden Age yuga in Indian Hindu belief. [Note: This yuga is called the Satya Yuga.] And that is a time of great expansion and connection. And so we could not, from the perspective of life here now, in so-called physical bodies, really perceive the true dramatic different nature of what that epoch expresses, where you’re in this world, but you’re not of it in terms of your point of observation.

You’re experiencing this world but you know you’re experiencing this world. You’re not in this world and you think this world is all you are, you’re there [cups his hands around his face]. You’re at the point where you are looking at and experiencing the world immediately that you are quote “in” but you’ve got points of observation, points of understanding, in the higher realms of consciousness, which can give you a totally different fix upon this reality.

For instance, if you are sitting in a house, and all the windows are shut – which is basically symbolic of what humans have been in this period we’ve been through – then you can think that the world and everything is in that house. But you open a window, as you pull your point of observation back not just from within that house but from much higher levels of perception – because of this connection between experiencing level and higher levels of consciousness – suddenly you realize the house is in a street! And you go out on the street you realize that the street’s in an estate, the estate’s in a town, the town’s in a county, the county’s in a country – Hey! I’m … I’m on a planet! And then you look out into the stars…

And… but all that has always been there, while you’ve been sitting in the room with the windows shut, thinking this is all there is [cups his hands around his face]. So this, that Golden Age period, where people knew that we were all one consciousness, I mean, meant that the conflict, the division, the competition, the I must win, I must get to the top of the greasy pole, the sense that there is division between us, there is apartness between us, that doesn’t manifest in these periods of expansion and understanding. We realize we’re one unified consciousness, which has different points of observation, which we give different names to.

BR: To jump sideways: this was beautifully presented in the Avatar movie, that you wrote…

DI: Yes, absolutely right. See I think… I’m not saying what James Cameron meant or symbolized by that movie, I don’t know, I can tell you what it symbolized to me. And, actually, that’s a good point because it relates to where I’m going with this.

What that manifestation of Golden Age expanded reality is, is, within this Time Loop – which is not really a loop, we may get to that as we go along – is information, an expanded level of information within the construct of this reality, which we decode through into holographic experience, and it’s a very different holographic experience to the one we’ve been having and the one we’re having now, because the information construct is very different to the one we’re decoding now.

What I am saying in the book is: something happened, in this reality, to create what I call a Schism. This Schism was a distortion within the information construct. And that distortion changed everything. One of the things it did… Because, I keep coming back to this, I think it’s so important: if we keep thinking physical – and physical is what it seems to be, physical – then we’re gonna lose the plot because it’s not like that.

This is a holographic illusory, apparently three-dimensional reality, but it’s not solid: we decode it like that, but it’s not actually solid. It’s the information construct, which is decoded through into this, and so if you take again, not even the analogy, the principle of holograms, you have got on a holographic print … information in wave form.

If you look at a holographic print, it looks pretty much like a fingerprint – now that’s no accident, either – and then they fire the laser at the holographic wave form, information, and, manifesting from that, is this apparently three-dimensional holographic figure, whatever’s been photographed, whatever information is on the print. And so at the same time, you have got the information construct, the wave form, and you’ve got the manifestation, the holographic manifestation from the wave form, which is the image, person, box, apple, whatever you photographed.

So when scientists say: Uh, how could something exist as wave form and particle form at the same time? It’s because they DO! When you are looking at a holographic figure, a holographic illusory three-dimensional figure, the information construct from which that is manifested doesn’t disappear and it [the holographic figure] just stands there alone: they stand there together! They’re different forms of the same thing. One is the information, one is the decoded information.

So what I’m saying with this, in terms of the sequence that I’m talking about, is when this information construct in this, what I would … let’s call it the Golden Age, was distorted, then that distortion had to manifest through into the decoded holographic world. And one of the ways that it did so was massive, enormous, catastrophic geological events. And these are recorded in accounts, ancient accounts and legends, all over the world. They talk about great volcanic, earthquake catastrophes, they talk about the Earth turning over and what have you, and they’re consistent all around the world in the way that they do this and tell these stories.

And then you’ve got people who’ve researched from a scientific point of view – geological, biological level – in more modern times, and they found that these ancient stories are mirrored in the biological and geological record.

So what happened when this distortion in the energetic information wave form foundation construct happened, it was manifested through into holographic reality as, well, I mean the Biblical version of it is the Great Flood but I think there have been many of these things, not just one, but certainly catastrophic ones. The other thing I’m saying it did, is that it created Schisms, distortions, in the human personality.

Because that harmony, that connection, that everything in harmony and connection with everything else – brilliantly symbolized as you say by the Blue people in the Avatar movie – that distortion brought an end to that. It brought an end to the harmony of the planet itself, the geological [unclear] catastrophes, but it fractured human personalities, that harmony became fractured.

And then we went into all these different emotional states and … distortions (again: distortion here – distortion here) that we see: all the emotional distortions, the fear which is a distortion, and other low-vibrational emotional states, worry, fear, and frustration, anger, hatred, conflict. All this started to manifest.

And we’re now in the period, I would suggest, where that distortion is being healed, by these Truth Vibrations, by this energetic change. Now this is fundamentally important to the control system, because the control system, in all its forms, is a holographic manifestation of the distortion!

If the distortion’s not there, the control system cannot manifest, because within a harmonious, balanced information construct, things like control over, hunger, famine, war, hatred, torture, satanist rituals, pedophilia, all this stuff cannot manifest. These are all manifestations of the distortion.

And as this distortion is healed… and what’s happening, Bill, I would suggest – I keep saying I suggest, I’m not telling people what to believe, I’m just saying what I feel – people who are waking up and going: Why hadn’t I seen it before? They’re the ones who are opening their minds and through that vibrating faster – because this suppression of vibrational state, the close mind, the density, breaks up when you open your mind to other possibilities – they’re the ones tuning to the information construct that’s coming in, the Truth Vibrations as I call them.

And the ones who are still in the control system and still supportive of it, they’re the ones that are still close-minded and are still, at this moment, attached to this old dense, low-vibrational epoch of experience. And so, like I’ve said earlier, as this distortion is healed, its manifestation must fall! Because this information construct is being deleted from the system.

And so what we’re seeing is not … and it may sound strange, but if you follow it through I don’t think it is. We are now seeing the control system at its peak of imposition. It seems to be moving faster and faster, more Orwellian laws and all the rest of it. More and more control, they want the microchips in people, they’re moving along that road, that agenda. We’re having our children – adults too, but particularly our children – targeted with electro-chemical distortions, in terms of the chemical additives to food and drink and the mobile phone, the microwave, electro-magnetic soup from all this electro-magnetic technology.

And this is all being thrown at us at this time – I would suggest, controversially maybe – not for the control system to get more power, but to defend the power it’s already had from these Truth Vibrations.

No longer can the old way of controlling people, where people just stay asleep [makes snoring sounds] … They don’t have to do too much! They don’t have to do too much at this point: they’ve got control, they’ve got control of the resources, they’ve got control of this, control of that, and quietly they can just feed off humanity energetically, resource-wise and everything, have humanity go along, being their slaves without realizing it – which is the greatest form of slavery, of course, being a slave and not realizing it.

But because of these Truth Vibrations and because they can see down what we call the timeline, down the Time Loop as we might perceive it, they could see some of this coming. And so they’ve focused on this period to throw everything at us, to try to stop us being affected fundamentally, profoundly, by this Truth Vibration transformation, because once we do that, [motions looking out from a restricted viewpoint], it’s game over.

And so, for me the amazing synchronicity between this vibrational change and people waking up, and this bombardment of multilevel, multidimensional, immensely detailed impositions – mentally, physically, emotionally – on the human race to suppress us and control us, these two have synched here because this will set us free and that is trying to stop that happening. No chance.

But what that will do is make the transformation more bumpy and more challenging than it would otherwise be without this seeking to stop it. Can’t stop it. This thinks it’s the irresistible force, the immovable object. It ain’t. This is the irresistible force and this is gonna have some real shocks as we move through the next little while up to 2016, 2017, maybe a little longer – certainly within my lifetime – as we see this apparently impregnable, unstoppable control system structure emerging; when we see that fall – because it’s a house of cards.

Why? Because the energetic information construct that’s held the house of cards together, which manifests itself massively as human apathy and human ignorance – which is fundamental to holding it together – that’s going. And so, the house of cards must fall. Sorry chaps, [it’s] just the way it is.

BR: So what was the new information that you presented at the Brixton Academy the other day?

DI: Well there was quite a lot. I was working on that presentation for, well, months, really, because it was really a new period in my life and I’m going around the world with it this year: Europe and America and stuff.

Maybe I could just explain how I’ve put this information – whatever people make of it – together over the years. It’s been very simple and it’s been a constantly recurring theme. It’s just repeated itself as I’ve moved through levels of understanding.

And when I – as we talked about the last time we chatted, Bill – I talked about what happened to me when I went to the psychic in 1990, when I felt for about a year that there was this presence around me, and when I was in a room alone, I wasn’t alone. And it got more and more and eventually… Long story short, I went to see a psychic for the first time in my life and she started, after two visits, on the third visit she started to get this stuff, this figure in her head and she said: I’m being told to tell you things, that I was going to go out on a world stage and I was going to reveal great secrets.

And I… you know me: I’m presenting the snooker and the sport at the BBC at the time. And I was the national spokesman for the Green Party and all that stuff, but I’m gonna go on a world stage and reveal great secrets… I mean, you know, what? But something inside me beyond the conscious level was going: You are. You are. Go with it! Go with it!

But, anyway, where I’m going with this is: among these messages that were given to me in 1990 were: He will say things and wonder where they came from. They will be our words. Sometimes we will put knowledge into his mind. Sometimes he will be led to knowledge. And another one was, a little bit later: Arduous seeking is not necessary. It was all organized a long time ago – words to that effect. All he has to do is follow the clues.

Now as you know, there’s a famous advert in Britain that’s been going around for a few years now, and the punch line is: It does exactly what it says on the tin. Well, all I can say about they, whoever they are at some level of disembodied consciousness, is that they have done exactly what they said on the tin.

And what’s happened over the years is that – right from the start, really – is that I’ve had an insight out of nowhere that something’s like it is. And then the five-sense information starts coming. Like, I’ll meet someone who brings up this subject and I pick up information about it. I’ll see a book suddenly about this information. I’ll have an experience which is about this information. I’ll come across documents. I might see something on the Internet about this information.

But it’s not like it’s like a week, a month, two months, three months. This is a concentrated sequence. And I’ve learned over the years that… to follow this and to recognize it, which is not difficult because it gets more powerful and the sequence gets smaller.

And the reptilian thing started coming out like that. I started to get insights in the fact that, not necessarily reptilian, but that there was a non-human element to this. And at that point I traveled America for place-to-place talking for about fifteen days and met twelve separate people who told me about reptilian entities and their experiences with them. And that’s how it works, and then it goes on. So, coming around to this new information, it was the same sequence.

I started writing this book from the early part… maybe about March, 2009, although a great chunk was stopped when I was traveling. And, I don’t know, a month, two months into it, I sat down to start writing that day and the energy in the room changed. And I thought: I know this, I recognize this. The energy in the room changed. There was a vibrational change. You could feel it. The atmosphere changed – a simple way of putting it – I recognize this.

And, what I then got as this was happening is, the basic first theme was: the Moon is not real. Of course, there’s more to know about that as came, but the Moon is not real, the Moon is not what you think it is. And I’m thinking… the Moon is not what you think it is. Now, I’ve had one or two inklings about that over the years. A little thought, you know, in the moment. But then it’s gone. It never got anywhere.

And so, I thought: the Moon’s not real. So, I put a few key words into NetFind, not expecting to find a bloody thing. And within a minute, two minutes, I don’t know, even less, I suppose, with the speed of Google and stuff, out came a book called, Who built the Moon? by two researchers who’ve written other books. Who built the Moon? I mean, you know, what a wonderful title for what I’ve just got here: the Moon’s not real.

And I read it. I sent for it and I read it immediately. And, I’m not saying every last thing in the book, or every last thing in any book, is 100 percent. I mean, crikey, we’re trying to uncover great mysteries and not least mysteries that don’t want to be uncovered or at least people who don’t want us to uncover them. So, you know, I’m not saying every last word in every book is 100 percent; of course it’s not. It’s not the way things are. But I was really, really impressed with the way they had shown the anomalies, the very strange, unexplainable anomalies about how… well first of all, about how the Moon was created.

When I started reading about the scientific explanations… And, that’s another thing, you know. So many scientific theories, by repetition become: This is how it was, scientific fact. And then you go: Hold on a second. Scientific fact? Let’s go back here … Hey! It’s a theory!

And I came across the Big Whack Theory about how the Moon was created. And, it’s that a Mars-type planet hit the Earth, a great chunk came off the Earth and became the Moon. And then I read, as I followed this through, that because the physics and stuff – the science of that – didn’t pan out, then they kind of altered it a bit so that the planet hit the Earth and then came back and had another go.

And I thought, Well that’s bloody desperate, that.

– I’ll give you one. Do you want another one?

– Yeah

– Okay, here you go. Here’s the Moon now. [You] see what you caused?

And the fact that the Moon is far bigger than it really should be as a satellite of the Earth, that its positioning and its geometry, geometric and mathematical relationship, between the Earth and the Sun particularly is very, very impressive and “what?”. And the fact that there is evidence that the Moon is hollow – to a large extent hollow. I think it’s in compartments.

And then I came across – which many people might have come across in the past, this is all very concertinaed – the two scientists from the Russian, Soviet Academy of Sciences, who wrote an article in, I think, Sputnik Magazine in the 1970s, posturing that the Moon was a construct, a hollow… not a total construct, necessarily, but a hollowed-out planetoid. Again: hollowed out. And that a very advanced extraterrestrial non-human, whatever you want to call it, life form, technologically advanced, had created this construct.

And they go into detail about how they think it’s constructed. And when you follow the way they say it’s constructed, it starts to answer anomalies that science goes: What? As one scientist said, the only thing you can really say about the Moon is its observational error; it shouldn’t be there in the way that it is.

One of the things the scientists said, for instance, is that on the outside of the Moon for about three miles or so, is an initial buffer zone, if you like, to protect it from being smacked by space debris and objects.

And then they say – I’m not saying this is absolutely 100 [percent] true, but I think the themes are probably absolutely right – then there’s like a twenty mile, they said, impregnable barrier. And then you’ve got the craters on the Moon which, despite their different sizes and obviously, power of impact, they’ve got a pretty universal depth, which people have said: How can that be, when you’ve got different?… So, something’s going so far and then no further.

Anyway, all this came together and I put loads of other… there’s a lot of detail in the book, and then I rang the oracle, didn’t I? So, I rang Credo Mutwa, the Zulu Shaman, the official historian for the Zulu Nation. And… I found that if you take the symbolism of Zulu legends, I found them to be extraordinarily accurate over the years.

And one of the things that makes me smile is: these mainstream anthropologists and historians and what have you, they so often take symbolic stories that the ancients tell and they decode them literally because they’re left-brain people – that’s all they can do, they can’t just spin the thing through the process of seeing it symbolic. Because we are at a time when we… it’s so much easier to communicate what we’re trying to say, because more and more and more, technology is mirroring the very reality that we are experiencing.

For instance, this virtual-reality universe is a vibrating information construct and we decode that information through the electrical, into the holographic, to create this reality. I’ve just described the Internet, you see. If the wireless Internet is in this room, then your computer over there can pull this worldwide collective reality out of the unseen ether. Well, that’s what we’re doing in a much more sophisticated way. This is why the information construct is so fundamental to the holographic reality that we experience.

And what the ancients had was none of this stuff! These seers and carriers of the knowledge, to try to get across what they were trying to say about reality and life, they had to use the symbolism that was available to them, and the symbolism that their audience, the people of that time, could understand.

All of which is a prerequisite to this. I called Credo. I told him nothing about my thoughts on the Moon and how… what stuff I’d kind of linked together up to that point.

I said one simple sentence:

– Credo, can you tell me any Zulu legends about the Moon?

– Oh yes, Mr. David – he said – We call the Moon an egg. We say the Moon is an egg.

Of course, an anthropologist who wasn’t aware of this stuff would go: The Moon’s an egg? [Whispers:] Primitive people. Primitive. Primitive. They’d never pass an exam, you know.

Why did they symbolize an egg? Because they say the Moon was hollowed out, was hollowed out by two brothers, reptilian brothers, called Umpanku and Rwani. And they were known as the Water Brothers in the Zulu legends. And, they say that they hollowed out the Moon and rolled it across the sky hundreds of generations ago. And when they brought it to the Earth, it created great geological catastrophe.

And, of course, when the Moon came in, one of the things it would do is make the Earth move. And then you’ve got this ancient theme of the Earth turning over. It would… basically, what it would do is destroy whatever was there before and then they can build, as everything settles down, those within the Moon can build their own new society. I’m absolutely certain that’s what happened.

And interestingly, of course, Bill, as you will well know, Umpanku and Rwani, who in Zulu legends had scaly skin like a fish, were two brothers that were called the Water Brothers. This is the legends of Zulu South Africa. Take that to Sumer, Babylon and the Sumerian tablets and you come into the Anunnaki who were led by Enki and Enlil. And certainly Enki was very much symbolized and associated with water. They were… again: they were brothers.

And again, it mirrors that whole story, and so many stories about brothers. Things like Cain and Abel and all these brother stories. I think you bring them back; they have an original theme coming back from these, what I would say, reptilian entities. And the Zulu legends say that Rwani and Umpanku were reptilian, were… they’re called there the Chitauri, the children of the serpent, children of the python. They stole the Moon from what they call the Great Fire Dragon and brought it to the Earth.

And… the Moon brought catastrophe, changed everything. Of course, it affected the angle and spin of the Earth – the whole bloody thing. It affects water. It has tremendous impacts on the human hormonal system which locks into the endocrine system, which locks into the pineal and pituitary gland of the third eye – seeing beyond five-sense sight, and being aware of levels beyond five senses. It has a fundamental impact. Never mind other things that I’m saying is coming out of that Moon. Being there, that size, that place has fundamental effects on the Moon.

And going back to what I was talking about earlier, I’m saying that when that Moon arrived, in association with other things that happened at the same time – because there’s a whole story to tell about Mars and what happened to that in this story – that that… You see, we look at the Moon like everything else and we see a solid Moon. That’s the holographic decoded level of it. Its prime state is an informational construct. Like everything in the wave form-base informational construct of this reality.

So as the Moon came in “physically”… it only came in physically in the holographic play-out reality, what we call five-sense reality – I call it, anyway, keep it simple. It was actually information moving in through the informational wave form construct and that caused the distortion, which is manifest on this planet of all the things we’ve talked about before. And that distortion has manifested itself in the control system.

It’s manifested itself in fractured human personalities, in disharmony, and in a desperately limited sense of self and the world. Because when you are in harmony and in balance, you can access higher levels of consciousness. But when your energy field is doing this: [motions agitation and babbling] all that stuff, with all the things – worry, fear, [babbling] – then, you’re not in that state.

And therefore, what you can tune into, and what you can bring down in terms of understanding, awareness, insight, even manifestation, is fundamentally limited to the harmonic, harmonious state of awareness that we were in before – humans were in before – the distortion.

And like I say, these Truth Vibrations are healing the distortion. And the manifestation of the distortion is now throwing everything at us to try to hold on to what is something that is being energetically deleted from the disk, which is why the world is going to change dramatically, and after this cusp is got through, dramatically for the better, dramatically for the better.

BR: Now, where does this lead back to about the significance of the Moon being not what it appears to be?

DI: Well, see… I think that when the Moon came in, as I mentioned earlier, it was in association with lots of other things. You know, when the ancients talked about a war of the gods in the heavens, I don’t think they were talking symbolically at all. What the symbolism is, we can debate, but… that people pick up from that. But I think there is a very good chance that it was actually literal. It was a battle between what we perceive to… what they perceived to be gods.

And I think the destruction of Mars, which I think was an occupied planet far more recently than people think, and the fact that there is this theme – not just with people like Immanuel Velikovsky, who’s famous for it, but also again in the Zulu legends: exactly the same – that there was a planet between Mars and Jupiter, and it was destroyed. And it was destroyed by some kind of high-tech weaponry.

If you look in Star Wars, you know… Star… You know, George Lucas, Bill, is such a massive insider. He ain’t talking from bloody imagination. And this stuff about: In a galaxy far, far away… Excuse me, this one. Thank you, George. And, you know, he has the theme there of a planet being destroyed and he has the theme of the Death Star. What is the Death Star? It looks like the Moon! And it’s a construct. And it’s a construct that’s used to try to take over planets.

I think there are many of these things, and I think that what the language of life and all this stuff I talked about earlier, the way this information is put before me, what it’s saying to me – I would suggest, anyway – is that there is a modus operandi whereby they bring these Moons in.

When they bring the Moons in, they have a fundamental effect on the planet as it is and therefore they basically, as they did here, have a blank sheet of paper. It’s over; that civilization: over. And then as things settle down, they start genetic manipulation and other manipulation, and they take over the society, take over the planet.

But one thing to mention is that these Moons are dependent upon the target planet for resources, for slave labor to create the resources and all the rest of it. So although there seems to be this dynamic that the Moon is in control of the planet, actually the Moon is completely dependent upon the planet for all that it needs.

And one of the common themes through the ancient accounts, through the Zulu legends and through people that I’ve met in the modern world over the years, is that these reptilian entities – who I say were within the Moon, not only there, mind, within the Earth and also in other areas of this solar system, but – they are terrified of exposure.

Because compared with the human population, there’s not that many of them. That’s why… one of the reasons they want to cull the human population – which is a recurring theme in conspiracy research – is because they can’t deal with the numbers.

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Bill Ryan, David Icke